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1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 06:09:12 EDT Strypey

   The main problem with Eps. 7,8, and 9 is that they needed to finish telling the stories of the 4, 4, 6 characters. Introducing some young characters is fine, but they needed to be bit player, who would then get their own story told in a 10, 11, 12. By skipping straight to making the younger characters the main focus, we miss a rare chance to see older people as action heroes, and end up with a retread of the 4,5,6 plots.

   1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 06:25:05 EDT Strypey

      in reply to

      #HanSolo did ok with this, and rumour has it that Harrison Ford was only willing to do one movie anyway. For me, his death was one of the most emotionally real moments of #TheForceAwakens, and show him completing his character arc from egotistical man-child, to rebel *with* a cause, to mature man ready to risk his life to save his son.

      1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 06:30:37 EDT Strypey

         in reply to

         The character most disrespected in 7, and especially in 8, was #LeiaOrgana. In the original movies she subverted the 'damsel in distress' trope, by grabbing a blaster and rescuing her rescuers. The new trilogy could have played her as a trained #Jedi, kicking arse and taking names. Instead she's reduced to tending the hearth and swooning in 7, and then #SleepingBeauty in 8.

         1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 06:36:38 EDT Strypey

            in reply to

            Why didn't Leia go with Han and the young folks to blow up the Starkiller base, like she did in the Battle of Endor? Especially when there was a chance of seeing her son. How much more poignant would it have been if Leia had watched Han killed by their son, rushing in too late to intervene? Imagine the dramatic possibilities of a confrontation between Leia and Luke about whether he's redeemable, after she'd seen that?

            1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 06:42:15 EDT Strypey

               in reply to

               In #TheLastJedi, why didn't Leia get to play the active role given to #Holdo, a new character, who we never had a chance to get to know, or care about? Holdo could have been introduced as a foil for Leia, arguing with her about Po's actions, and eventually sacrificing herself to save the day. These two and #Ackbar could have been the grizzled veterans, having tense arguments about how their crews were going to survive.

               1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:03:10 EDT Strypey

                  in reply to

                  If they'd filmed 8 this way, then the death of #CarrieFisher - while still a tragic loss - could have been worked around. The ending could have been redone so Leia sacrificed herself instead of Holdo, and Luke survived. Then 9, written about Leia kicking arse as the only remaining veteran force user, could have been rewritten slightly for Luke to play that role. What do they do now?

               2. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:07:06 EDT Strypey

                  in reply to

                  Why do people defend this movie as some kind of win for progressive identity politics, when it reduces the most empowered female character from the original trilogy to a bit part?!? I'd wager most fans would have loved to see Leia leading from the front, blaster or light sabre in hand, what a powerful representation for older women! But no. We got #SleepingBeauty Leia.

                  1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:09:45 EDT Strypey

                     in reply to

                     As for the treatment of #LukeSkywalker, let me put it like this. The grouchy old hermit was a great character, and #MarkHamill played him well. The scene with #Yoda was genuinely touching. But that hermit character was not the Luke we knew and loved in the original trilogy.

                     1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:16:58 EDT Strypey

                        in reply to

                        The #LukeSkywalker in #ReturnOfTheJedi surrendered to the #EmperorPalpatine and #DarthVader, two of the most believably corrupted characters in film, because he believed Vader was redeemable. There's no way he would have given up hope and refused to fight with Leia, no matter how cut up he was over Kylo Ren's betrayal. If he was off-the-grid, he would have been looking for something, to give them the edge against the FirstOrder, not hiding out drinking seal cum.

                        1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:20:13 EDT Strypey

                           in reply to

                           The Luke from the original trilogy would never have thought about killing #BenSolo, not even for a second, no matter how badass #Snoke is. I mean, how badass can Snoke be anyway, we never get to find out anything about him, before his half-trained student killed him easily (remember Kylo was taken to Snoke to "finish his training" at the end of #TFA, and almost no time has passed when #TLJ starts). The real Luke would have faced Snoke, and it would have been awesome.

                           1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:27:32 EDT Strypey

                              in reply to

                              Imagine a scene where Leia and Luke are reunited, Leia still smarting from seeing Han die at their son's hands. She's given up on him. She wants Luke to avenge Han. Luke refuses, "there's still good in him". Luke and Rey go off together to try to redeem Kylo. Luke matches force powers with Snoke, while Rey and Kylo fight together, and have that awesome moment where the light sabre breaks in half (for me, one of the few emotionally real moments in #TLJ).

                              1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:31:25 EDT Strypey

                                 in reply to

                                 Maybe while all this is happening, Snoke has overcome Luke, and almost kills him, but that's when Kylo takes advantage of his master being distracted to kill him, saving Luke in the process. Luke is too weakened to talk, queue Rey and Kylo's dialogue about which way Kylo should jump now. Kylo is about to kill Luke, but Leia's force intuition saw this coming, queue the #Raddis ramming the #Supemacy.

                                 1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:34:31 EDT Strypey

                                    in reply to

                                    See, it's not that #TLJ didn't have the raw materials of an amazing Star Wars movie. It just didn't seem to know how to put them together, without breaking the universe, and our suspension of disbelief. https://mastodon.nzoss.nz/media/hXZh55Ij0Gi_9yN5co0

                                    1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:40:55 EDT Strypey

                                       in reply to

                                       I also want to mention the way #TLJ lets the #Resistance down, by completely failing to understand how a #RebelAlliance works. It's not a regular army. There's no such thing as "deserters", because everyone involved is a volunteer, and they can leave whenever they lose faith in the integrity or competence of the leaders. The leaders are militia commanders, not military officers, and there is only #ChainOfCommand during battles, with seniority decided right before.

                                       1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:49:46 EDT Strypey

                                          in reply to

                                          Leia has no military title in Ep 4-6, which is why she's constantly referred to as "#PrincessLeia". Nobody tries to court martial Han for desertion for leaving before the battle of Yavin, or on Hoth. He's free to go. Nobody demotes Luke for wandering off with an X-Wing, he saved their asses at Yavin, winning their respect, and a role in the leadership, despite being a total newcomer. #TFA manages to capture the fragile, cooperative nature of the rebel enterprise.

                                          1. Strypey (strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 15:53:50 EDT Strypey

                                             in reply to

                                             The loose, cooperative nature of the rebels in 4-6, the respect for dissent and initiative, is what makes them fundamentally different from the Empire. This matters a lot, because in #TLJ, the hierarchical, bureaucratic nature of the Resistance and Holdo make them much harder to empathize with or root for as the good guys. The difference between the #Resistance and the #FirstOrder is only in the degrees of impersonal officiousness, not a clear contrast.

                                          2. notklaatu (klaatu@mastodon.xyz)'s status on Wednesday, 06-Jun-2018 16:01:43 EDT notklaatu

                                             in reply to

                                             @strypey
                                             What does that say about the society that created TLJ vs the originals. It's almost like we modern folk can't even conceive something that is not structured by militaristic authority, even in our fiction.