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1. musicman (musicman@nu.federati.net)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Aug-2021 17:55:57 EDT musicman
   Any #JDBC performance improvements in the last couple of years worth knowing about?
   1. lnxw48a1 (lnxw48a1@nu.federati.net)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Aug-2021 18:03:46 EDT lnxw48a1

      in reply to
      @musicman I’ve mostly stayed away from the #Java world the last few years. A combination of not being allowed to use it at work and seeing what #Oracle is doing to anyone that is immersed in that ecosystem.
      
      But back in the day, I remember experimenting with McKoi and Apache Derby as part of a Java based help desk app I was writing.
      1. musicman (musicman@nu.federati.net)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Aug-2021 19:44:06 EDT musicman

         in reply to
         Oracle has largely been a good steward of #Java. The CentOSization of Java has been complex, and sure, there have been some Oraclisms, But the Java ecosystem is as healthy as it has ever been.
         
         Part of the angst around Java over the last few years has simply been people groaning about change, but ultimately the modularization that came in 9, and the "rapid" release cycle is going to be good for Java. I mean, we are already years in at this point. I think it's obvious it has been good.
         
         You can use our JDK/JRE builds if you like, but your distribution is going to have you covered, without having to deal with Oracle: https://www.openlogic.com/openjdk-downloads
         
         There are lots of #JDK providers that aren't Oracle.
         
         Of course, all of this has to be viewed from the Oracle lens. If Oracle didn't think this was the best thing for their bottom line, they wouldn't do it. Someone over there has convinced Larry that a heavy Java ecosystem is good for Oracle and that getting the JDK out in the open is good for that.
         
         Then, of course, there's the API bullshit, and that really doesn't have much to do with Java at the end of the day. That's Larry having a pissing contest with Google. It could have ended up that they ended up pissing on the entire industry, but aside from a lot of unnecessary angst, I don't think they have really done any damage there.
         1. musicman (musicman@nu.federati.net)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Aug-2021 19:45:08 EDT musicman

            in reply to
            healthy, not heavy...
         2. lnxw48a1 (lnxw48a1@nu.federati.net)'s status on Wednesday, 04-Aug-2021 20:42:33 EDT lnxw48a1

            in reply to
            I have OpenJDK installed through my distro ... #Java is necessary for Jedit and Netbeans.
            
            I have no need for things like #McKoi / McKoi DDB / #Derby / #HSQLDB / #H2 or even #Tomcat and #Jetty these days, but I'm very tempted to relearn some Java Servlet and JSP / JSF to create my personal site and using a Java based database as the backend.
            
            Or #Velocity, if that's still around. I barely got to touch that, but it seemed to be a big step upward.
            
            Still I was talking about things like someone wanting to donate a corporate sponsored JDK project to either Apache or Eclipse and Oracle nixing the whole thing. There are organizations now building upon DotNet partly because of that.
            1. musicman (musicman@nu.federati.net)'s status on Thursday, 05-Aug-2021 09:19:15 EDT musicman

               in reply to
               I think you are referring to this: https://www.infoq.com/news/2019/05/end-of-javax-package/
               
               Ultimately, I think this quote sums it up if you want to look at it as a positive:
               "Oracle contributed millions of lines of code in the reference implementations for Java EE, including GlassFish, Jersey, Grizzly, etc. Oracle contributed the Java EE TCK. This was a huge step for them, as it was highly confidential and proprietary until then. This was a very large asset, with millions of dollars in Java EE licensing revenue attached to it. Oracle is licensing their copyrights in all of the Java EE specifications. This includes all of the past work that happened at Sun and BEA, so it is a very large percentage of the overall content of the specifications."
               
               I'm not convinced what Oracle did is any different than what Red Hat does. It's just more complicated because it's a language. And maybe that's a salient point. We don't treat pencils and nuclear bombs the same though they can both be weapons. Matters of degree matter.
               
               Oracle gonna Oracle. I guess I'm just not going to waste cycles being upset about that, and I'm just focusing on the positive.
               
               Fundamentally though, the doomsayers have been proven wrong about Java. Ultimately, that's my point.